Blue Stew: 9/3/09
Posted by 
Amatera on Thursday, September 3, 2009 - 14 Comments Tags: Lore, Warrior, ancilorn, buffs, cataclysm, commanding shout, cooldown, expansion, ghostcrawler, nethaera, qq, stats, weapon skill
Amatera on Thursday, September 3, 2009 - 14 Comments Tags: Lore, Warrior, ancilorn, buffs, cataclysm, commanding shout, cooldown, expansion, ghostcrawler, nethaera, qq, stats, weapon skill
Blue Stew is a new daily column bringing you a delicious concoction of developer news, thoughts, and opinions straight from the boiling pot that is the official World of Warcraft forums. The highlights of each day include additional commentary by Project Lore staff.
It's a surprisingly tame day on the forums, folks. Well, of course there's the usual whining, and some questions about the Paid Faction Change, but if you want to find answers to those or discuss the new service, Project Lore's coverage is a really good place to start (I even wrote it myself!). With that said, I've still managed to cherry-pick a few things that I think are worth looking at:
So Explain To Me Again...
Weapon Skill: Quite possibly the most useless skill in the game! Wait, wasn't that supposed to be Spirit?
Nerthuz must be suffering from Memory Gremlins in her brain again, because she can't remember what she was told last time she asked about Weapon Skill. It must be hard with those nasty little critter eatin' up your thoughts and all. But, hey, she has a point. What is up with Weapon Skill, anyway?
This is an issue we've covered here at Project Lore before. Why iTZKoopA posted something about it just one month ago, and he came to the conclusion that it was a sloppy, poorly-implemented stat, though it may have simply been used as a limiter to keep people from tackling mobs way above their current level. But, then, couldn't weapon proficiency simply be built into levels instead of being something you need to raise? Why not just tack on an extra five points every time you ding and automatically pro-rate new skills you learn from Weapon Trainers?
Lore-wise, I suppose there is some sort of justification. Ancilorn points out, in accordance with the theme of Nerthuz's original post: "The worlds most skilled swordsman are not so skilled when it comes to wielding axes in combat. They would have to hone their skill to become competent at wielding axes in combat effectively." Indeed, it makes sense that while just about anybody should be able to theoretically wield any weapon, Weapon Skill is associated with how well they can actually do it. In real life, anyone can learn to shoot a gun, but not everybody can be a Bob Munden.
Still, I think it's an iffy stat. It's not terribly inconvenient to max out, but it does feel kind of useless. Even if its inclusion can be justified, maybe it should've been tossed out like all those other stats were at BlizzCon.
Cataclysm Compilation
Nothing snarky to say about Frejya, the kind of person that everyone on the official forums should strive to be. And it seems that Blizzard approves, as well, as they've given her the hallowed green text of a V.I.P. (Very Important Poster).
Now that the Cataclysm section has been opened, Nethaera thought it was high time to move Frejya's extensive and resourceful thread on the next expansion to the new forum. The only flaw with it, of course, is the lack of back-linking to Project Lore! Be sure to check it out if you need to know something about Cataclysm on the fly!
Two Minute Buffs Need [To Be] Changed!
It just wouldn't be a normal day on the forums without Ghostcrawler addressing a little bit of QQ. This time, 'letter Z' fanatic Bearlizion wantz to know why Blizzard dizcriminatez againzt all of hiz two-minute buffz. This is where I bring up something we talked about yesterday, namely people who don't play the game as it is and rather desire to play it the way they want it to be. Usually, this means ignoring basic play mechanics in favor of unrestricted convenience.
Why can't people realize that without limiters placed on your class, it wouldn't be fun to play at all? Ghostcrawler's sage advice shines like a light from the heavens once again: "With warrior shouts, the intent is that the resources do matter. You might not have enough rage at any given moment and part of the skill required in playing a warrior is making sure you have enough resources to both shout and do your other damage."
The fun in playing the game comes from strategizing in combat and figuring out how to manage your resources and when to use your skills. As I see it, most Warriors (especially tanks), already deal with a rather bland experience and the best thing to do would be to make them more complex, not easier to play. GC goes on to detail a couple of ways in which that could be accomplished, but the common theme seems to be restructuring rage so that a Warrior tank would have to pay attention to it throughout an encounter and not just at the beginning of it.
You guys do remember the old days, right? When threat was actually something people had to worry about? I know I can recall the days of having to strategically limit my DPS and make alternate use of Feint and Vanish to clear my aggro on the target.
His other core idea is perhaps putting key Warrior buffs on CDs: "Imagine (I am arm waving for a moment) that Battle Shout and Commanding Shout didn't cost any rage and in fact gave you rage, but were on a cooldown. Then using the shouts might become a more interesting choice -- you'd want to use them at moments when you're rage-starved and generally not when you have a full bar. However, you'd also want to keep them going because of their buff so you couldn't neglect to use them too often either. A challenge of playing the class / a test of your skill would be to shout at the right moment to keep the buff up but also make sure you earn the rage when you most needed it."
Sure sounds more interesting to me! But I don't play a Warrior as my main, so I'd like to hear what you more experienced players think of this sort of change. Keep in mind that they're only ideas and this is not an indication that the development team is going to suddenly change the class' mechanics. I just happen to believe that making any class more strategic to play can only be a good thing!
It's a surprisingly tame day on the forums, folks. Well, of course there's the usual whining, and some questions about the Paid Faction Change, but if you want to find answers to those or discuss the new service, Project Lore's coverage is a really good place to start (I even wrote it myself!). With that said, I've still managed to cherry-pick a few things that I think are worth looking at:
So Explain To Me Again...
Weapon Skill: Quite possibly the most useless skill in the game! Wait, wasn't that supposed to be Spirit?Nerthuz must be suffering from Memory Gremlins in her brain again, because she can't remember what she was told last time she asked about Weapon Skill. It must be hard with those nasty little critter eatin' up your thoughts and all. But, hey, she has a point. What is up with Weapon Skill, anyway?
This is an issue we've covered here at Project Lore before. Why iTZKoopA posted something about it just one month ago, and he came to the conclusion that it was a sloppy, poorly-implemented stat, though it may have simply been used as a limiter to keep people from tackling mobs way above their current level. But, then, couldn't weapon proficiency simply be built into levels instead of being something you need to raise? Why not just tack on an extra five points every time you ding and automatically pro-rate new skills you learn from Weapon Trainers?
Lore-wise, I suppose there is some sort of justification. Ancilorn points out, in accordance with the theme of Nerthuz's original post: "The worlds most skilled swordsman are not so skilled when it comes to wielding axes in combat. They would have to hone their skill to become competent at wielding axes in combat effectively." Indeed, it makes sense that while just about anybody should be able to theoretically wield any weapon, Weapon Skill is associated with how well they can actually do it. In real life, anyone can learn to shoot a gun, but not everybody can be a Bob Munden.
Still, I think it's an iffy stat. It's not terribly inconvenient to max out, but it does feel kind of useless. Even if its inclusion can be justified, maybe it should've been tossed out like all those other stats were at BlizzCon.
Cataclysm Compilation
Nothing snarky to say about Frejya, the kind of person that everyone on the official forums should strive to be. And it seems that Blizzard approves, as well, as they've given her the hallowed green text of a V.I.P. (Very Important Poster).
Now that the Cataclysm section has been opened, Nethaera thought it was high time to move Frejya's extensive and resourceful thread on the next expansion to the new forum. The only flaw with it, of course, is the lack of back-linking to Project Lore! Be sure to check it out if you need to know something about Cataclysm on the fly!
Two Minute Buffs Need [To Be] Changed!
It just wouldn't be a normal day on the forums without Ghostcrawler addressing a little bit of QQ. This time, 'letter Z' fanatic Bearlizion wantz to know why Blizzard dizcriminatez againzt all of hiz two-minute buffz. This is where I bring up something we talked about yesterday, namely people who don't play the game as it is and rather desire to play it the way they want it to be. Usually, this means ignoring basic play mechanics in favor of unrestricted convenience.
Why can't people realize that without limiters placed on your class, it wouldn't be fun to play at all? Ghostcrawler's sage advice shines like a light from the heavens once again: "With warrior shouts, the intent is that the resources do matter. You might not have enough rage at any given moment and part of the skill required in playing a warrior is making sure you have enough resources to both shout and do your other damage."
The fun in playing the game comes from strategizing in combat and figuring out how to manage your resources and when to use your skills. As I see it, most Warriors (especially tanks), already deal with a rather bland experience and the best thing to do would be to make them more complex, not easier to play. GC goes on to detail a couple of ways in which that could be accomplished, but the common theme seems to be restructuring rage so that a Warrior tank would have to pay attention to it throughout an encounter and not just at the beginning of it.
You guys do remember the old days, right? When threat was actually something people had to worry about? I know I can recall the days of having to strategically limit my DPS and make alternate use of Feint and Vanish to clear my aggro on the target.
His other core idea is perhaps putting key Warrior buffs on CDs: "Imagine (I am arm waving for a moment) that Battle Shout and Commanding Shout didn't cost any rage and in fact gave you rage, but were on a cooldown. Then using the shouts might become a more interesting choice -- you'd want to use them at moments when you're rage-starved and generally not when you have a full bar. However, you'd also want to keep them going because of their buff so you couldn't neglect to use them too often either. A challenge of playing the class / a test of your skill would be to shout at the right moment to keep the buff up but also make sure you earn the rage when you most needed it."
Sure sounds more interesting to me! But I don't play a Warrior as my main, so I'd like to hear what you more experienced players think of this sort of change. Keep in mind that they're only ideas and this is not an indication that the development team is going to suddenly change the class' mechanics. I just happen to believe that making any class more strategic to play can only be a good thing!
Reader Comments (14)
First!
My main is a warrior. 2 minutes shouts really dont bother me because rage is pretty plentiful especially when youre a tank. Really, you dont have to concentrate that hard unless things turn bad at the same time youre rage runs out which is pretty rare.
Weapon skill, especially for a warrior is definitley the most non sensical thing ever. Really the biggest factor in different weapon types is what classes can use them. All it does is make it so if you find a really nice weapon and forget weapon skill exists, you kill yourself when the enemy blocks every attack
I have a warrior as an alt and even at lower levels when
rage(you would think) should be an issue, it never was.
And even still there are potions for this and as long as your haste and speced right, you should have no problems. Besides, most npc fights are quick and in raids, if you have to worry about rage, then you are not playing right...
My Favorite is the DKs that QQ about Horn of winter only being 2 min (3 glyphed), if you dont have this in your rotation at some point just for the RP you need to rethink your rotation. Basically i hit it every time all my rune are on CD just to have something to do most of the time :P.
“Imagine (I am arm waving for a moment) that Battle Shout and Commanding Shout didn’t cost any rage and in fact gave you rage, but were on a cooldown."
Horn of Winter anyone?
And /agree Maltreth
When I'm on my dk I use it every time it's up when I'm in a non-pvp fight
im still doing my hunter QQ. i dont have time to QQ about other classes.
When did Warriors get Horn of Winter...? I thought that was a DK ability; so that 'buff' only works when partied...
Warriors are the only Class that have a (main; before Bear form Druids get all panty-bunched) secondary 'life bar' that starts at 0; if Rage potions give you a g'treed start fixed start amount, then that's where (I admit) I've been going wrong... Bloodrage shouldn't penalise Health, IMO - esp. at low levels, when Health levels are so low as to be *decimated* by the 'cost' of Bloodrage.
All Warriors in favour of a Bloodrage Glyph that negates (rather than reduces, as I think it currently is) the Heath cost...?
Oh; and by the way... enough of the "Warrior = Tank" mantra - some of us (me, for example) are Fury DPS.
i have a warrior alt i never had issues with the shouts but i did raid with 3 other warriors the buff lasting 2 minutes is a little low maybe adding a reagent to the game to boost it wouldnt be a bad idea like the paladin and druid buffs. With all the qq that goes on in the game all the classes will soon mirror each other.
I'm not sure if this affects other classes in different ways, but when I bought my Hunter a shiny new crossbow to level with, my ranged crit change fell through the floor, dropping from ~17% to ~5%. The crossbow was better in all stats than my former bow. The only difference was that I had max weapon skill with my bow and only 1 weapon skill with my new crossbow. One run of RFC and 200 weapon skills later my crit chance was back where it was supposed to be.
Watching my character screen while aimlessly shooting mobs my crit chance seems to be rising by about 0.04% with every weapon skill gained.
He's arm waving; as in throwing out random stuff; as in not likely to happen; as in THATS IT
My level 63 Ret Paladin cleared Hellfire Ramparts the otherday and got the Polearm drop off. I was thinking, "Dude! Sweet! Best polearm in the game for a few levels at least!" then I looked at my polearm skill. 43. lawlz. Those rats in Deeprun Tram won't know what hit 'em.
as a tank.....i was exstatic 2 finally get my teldrassil protector as an upgrade from my infantry assualt blade(1st boss HUK)...however....i had 0 axe skill....so i go back to eatern kingdoms doin the quests i missed 2 get my skill up.....the next day my skill is 200.....nowhere close enough 4 Heroics....since HUP was the daily....i ran it and finally won th red sword of courage.....so i wasted 25 seals just 2 get a weap i didnt use....AT ALL bcuasae of my dam weap skill
When comparing weapon skills between WoW and real life..and after watching the Bob Munden video, this Swedish clip comes to mind:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AoOmq_pKXB8