Sarth 3D: Progression or Pride?
Bastosa on Thursday, March 5, 2009 - 35 Comments Tags: Mount, achievement, drakes, obsidian sanctum, progression, raiding, sarth 3d, sartharion, title, twilight vanquisher 
In all my time raiding in WoW I have not seen an issue quite as polarizing as the Sartharion Encounter in The Obsidian Sanctum with all three drakes left alive (commonly called Sarth 3D.) This has been especially true in my guild lately as it is the last major hurtle we still have to overcome.
This encounter is commonly regarded as the most challenging fight in the current end game, and is something only a handful of guilds have accomplished. The incentive for winning this encounter is an achievement, an awesome title, and a rare mount that will only drop in this encounter. For me, there is also the sense that you have beat the hardest fight in the end game, but for many that is not enough.
See, there has been a lot of debate in my guild if this is something worth striving for. The guild has been split sharply into two separate camps. One camp, the camp I am a member of says: yes, this is important. My reasoning is simple. It is progression, it is the only fight we have yet to win, and I want to win it!
The second camp says: no, its is not worth all the time and resources we put into it. They say it is not progression, as it does not add any usable gear to the loot table, there are no new bosses behind him, and downing him will not help us at all in Ulduar. Essentially they see it as an achievement and nothing more.
While I am full aware that the 3 drake loot table adds no gear over the 2 drake loot table, I am going to have to express my opinion against camp 2. For me, raiding has never been about the loot. I’ve downed hundreds of bosses without the benefit of receiving loot personally. I play the game to overcome challenges. More importantly overcome challenges with my friends and guildmates. That’s why I play the game, to do something fun and challenging! This is the last challenge left for our guild.
Now I am aware that people have different priorities in this game. Some like raiding more than others. I for one love raiding and am not bothered by wiping for hours on end, as long as it is a means to an end. Some people clearly are bothered by it, it can be frustrating, and more importantly expensive (repair bills aren’t cheap!).
While we continue to grind away, and I am hopeful we are close, there is an undercurrent of internal conflict on every pull. For me it seems that Sarth 3D is something you have the motivation for or you don’t. My guild is unfortunately split on the issue. How about you guys? Is this a worthy goal, a waste of resources, or something you got out of the way a long time ago?
Reader Comments (35)
Dang bastosa id join your guild if i was part of the alliance.... and was on your serever (hehe), my guild kinda sucks and ive QQed alot about it lately. I mean we ahvnt even done a full 10 man naxx run! but i haz alot of RL friends in this guild so im not leaveing. I just wish we'd get better guildies....
Btw i totally agree on wipeing, i mean it sucks when it happens over and over but ill go on. Many people (excuse this next comment) bich about wipeing and then leave, i fricken hate it. I'd say go for it so your guild can show off, plus i mean a ttile and drake?! hello you all dont have anything else to do before Uldar! go get that drake!
Yes Sarth 3D still proves challenging to my guild as well even though we have accomplished it, but the thing is that it is progression. Let me put this into 2 simple reasons:
1. If ur guild thinks Sarth 1D and 2D is progression because of gear then that still does not lay off 3D as progression
2. The new raid Ulduar is gonna have more than half there bosses with a similar set up as Sartharion, which means that there will be more than one way to do these bosses and will add to the loot table. So if this is what is occuring in what will now be natural progression then people are gonna be more impressed that u went the whole mile rather than saying hey we did the boss thats all there is to it.
I can see this from both prospectives. It can get frustrating and I personally know I would have to take a few breaks. However, I enjoy a challenge as well. Learning something new or discovering a way that works for downing a boss. It's a wonderful experience.
And what do they mean that it's not going to help in Ulduar? What if there's a boss fight towards the end that no one has seen before and it has similarities to Sarth 3D? Yet this boss drops a non-tier epic loot item for each class, a tier item for available classes, and something else truly amazing. (The golden egg of all golden eggs and it doesn't have just chocolate inside it!)
Now your busting your buns to figure this out while guilds that have completed Sarth 3D are flying through it because they know, and realize, this fight is similar.
Just tell them, all fights are learning experiences and you never know when Blizz will pop something into a fight that they've done before.
Kick anyone who refuses to do it 'just because it's an achievement'. Kick anyone who brings loot into a conversation about progression. People like that will only hold you back and you will just find yourself, months later, after everything has been nerfed and the achievements removed from the game, wishing you could stab people in the face over the Internet.
Think of it this way: achievements, titles, pets, whatevers ... these are the only semi-meaningful things that will be left to mark the time you spent in the game. Without these you might as well uninstall WoW and get on with your life.
Its the best fight of all you people dont want to down sarth+3d they are missing a whole lot of fun, cus this fight test you in all the possible ways (survival, dps/tank/healer), you most know what to do there without the help of the others. For me I would say if uldaur will have something simillar to this i will be happy.
Honestly, if you've tried it more than once and enough people that you call them a 'camp' think you can't do it, your guild is probably just too full of nubs to pull it off. Maybe it is a waste of time.
Sarth 3D isn't that difficult or complex. It just requires that everyone know what to do and not stand in the fire. Is everyone in 25-man gear? Does everyone know their class? Does DPS know how not to stand in the fire? It's a likely win. You just can't have weak links is all.
It's the difference between guilds that will down progression raids and those that will have to wait until Blizz pity nerfs it into reach for them.
I think a title and mount is a good reward over loot and that making and loot would be a unfair advantage over the people that can't get it down also the mount and title will last for a long as you play and loot is replaced all the time
I can't add anything to this. My guild has only ever tried Sartharion + 1D. It took us 8 or 9 wipes before we finally did it, but i've never tried it with 2D or even 3D.
Have any of u guys SEEN the Twilight Drake? I would cut off my leg with a rusty, dull saw to get that awsome looking thing.