Project Lore

Yo that is totally true. I mine and only roll against other miners for the ore. But none of the DE people i ran with ever said anything so i did not think about it that way.

I Agree 100%. I am an up and coming enchater, and I really NEED the shards let alone want them. I am a skinner too, so, I know what it's like. Anway, yeah, enchanters should get the sharsds.

I know how you feel i had an enchanter for a long time and got tired of just that problem and re-rolled differant proffs. i didnt mind so much at first but like alot of unlucky enchanters out there, I always roll low. i figure at least give the first shard to the enchanter and give a chance to roll to everyone after that.

The rolling of the shard is to replace the random roll for the piece of gear.
If there were no enchanter, everyone would just roll to vendor the piece of unused gear.
If there is an enchanter, we give it to the enchater to DE, then roll on the shard.
If that makes sense. =\

You do make a valid argument. I have to somewhat disagree with you on the matter, though. The reason why is because comparing sharding to skinning/mining is a bit like the apples vs. oranges. You can find mining nodes and skins (like the Arctic Fur) just about anywhere in WoW.

But blues and epics are inherently hard to get. You may have the world drops, but are you going to try to get those? Doubtlessly, no. The best place to farm for blues and epics are instances and raids, which usually requires other players to spend their time helping you out. Also, I do not believe that enchanting -- while the primary one -- is the only profession that needs shards to skill up.

So here's my outlook on this issue you bring up: Yes, the person doing the disenchanting ought to keep at least one of the shards. The rest can be rolled on.

(And by the way, my pugs do roll on mining nodes if we come across one in the instance.)

thats completely true. its not just with mats, man i've seen clothies need on mail, plate and leather just because they have an alt that can wear. i mean everyone has alts but u don't take from group loot for them.

Well,I for one disagree, the items you disenchant give quite a load of money if sold to vendors. What you can always do is try to reason with'em, say if they pass you'll give them the enchant of the reagents from it,you get your level up and the other guy gets an enchant. and really,how often are there nodes in instances? and does this mean you should give the cloth to the tailor?

Just to clear up a bit: If everyone greeds on the item and the enchanter wins, then of course, he/she should keep the shard.
But, most people like to give the crappy blue to the enchanter to DE so have a chance to get a shard (which benefits them more than 9g by selling it to a vendor)

I do totaly agree! I have allways felt wierd when i rolled of the gems, but cool - i rolled, and won sometimes. But I agree, enchanters should have their shard for themselves, as long as the gear is useless.

But i also think you should talk to your party before entering the instance, what the loot-rules is. Rolling on shards/lether/ores, or whatever you wanna do.

If i were an enchanter, i would be pissed if i had to give away my shards for free, because i know how expensive it is to lvl-up.

In ways I like to agree with you, but there is quite a difference between skins/mines to shards. The issue is skins and nodes be pass by if neither profession is in group. No benefit to anyone. Now when comes to shards there is an option to make it into shards. That loot that be DE could still be vendor for gold which is what usually happens if no needs around. The loot of the boss will be use in some form and still be there, DE or not. That is why you still roll, you just changing the thing that be roll/vendor for gold to something that be sold for gold. Just be happy with skill lv up.

Now if running with guildies you can probably convince the need for the shards. Pugs aka people who probably don't know you for most cases would like the chance for more money and would get that chance if your there or not. Personally I could care less if the chanter keeps them or not, rather make it through an instance or raid with little issues.

I agree with most of your reasoning here Bastosa.

My idea is just one step modified: I think enchanters should get first pick of DE'ed mats, possibly two, and then everyone rolls on the rest.

I have an alt that is a healer / tailor / enchanter and not only do I get few props for healing, I get fewer props for DEing.

A green drop or a BOP blue or purple that has no use except for the, let's say, 5 gold vendor is one thing, but that same item could become a DE mat that could be worth 10 - 15g value if there is someone can create it. Therefore, an enchanter/disenchanter adds value to the item, and for that alone, the person should be allowed to request and receive a fee commiserate with the service provided.

Now sure one runs the 'risk' of DEing an item into a 'worthless' mat, but here are two important insights into that:
• First, the item to be DEed is usually considered 'worthless' since it's being DEed and as such not in high demand.
• Second, the vendor amount for most 'worthless-and-should-be-DEed' items is usually equivalent to the 'worthless' DE mat gained from it by DEing it.

There may be those that disagree with this thinking but as someone who provides a service that adds value I would expect to be compensated for the service I prove, and not just that I get to roll for mats I created. If that's gonna be the case, I might just start needing on everything with the completely legitimate rational that I need it to level my enchanting.

But probably the best thought is discuss loot and DE mats BEFORE beginning an instance or raid. It will save you from the frustration later.

Saint

If I'm not allowed to roll on the shard then I'm not going to pass on that blue boss drop so you can disenchant it. I will select greed and vendor it if I win. pretty sure the rest of the group would too.

However, it would be a different story if the enchanter was a guildie/friend of mine and they asked if they could have the blue drop that no-one needs. I would pass for them no problem.

As an enchanter myself, your predicament seems odd to me. Don't your groups all decide before hand, or at least by the first boss drop, whether to DE unused drops?

If the group decides to shard items, they should be passing on the roll (or at least letting the enchanter roll NEED if nobody else does). Otherwise with no enchanter they'd all be rolling Greed to have their chance to vendor it. I don't agree that just because you are an enchanter, you by default get to shard and keep all unused items.

If you don't like sharding for the group, don't do it. Just roll Greed like everyone else and shard your own wins later.

I was just thinking about this the other day. It certainly isn't fair in the traditional sense. On the other hand I like being able to provide that utility in groups.

It would be nice if the expectation was changed so that the enchanter comes away with at least one shard. We should be compensated for increasing the value of these items, and losing valuable mats to the rng just doesn't seem right. Mats that we can't just go out and farm whenever we want.

I agree with what you said, but 9 times out of 10 the group doesn't agree with that. So what I do is when the DE'er says roll, If I win the roll, I tell them to keep my shard. Its only fair, They took the time to level enchanting, I didn't and I'd be damned if I am sharing my ore... XD

~Teliko

I give shards I win to the enchanters in my guild. If you don't get shards from your guildies, then don't be giving them free enchants. I also give greens. I don't pass on greens; I take them with the intent of giving them to our enchanter(s) along with the shards.

If you get shards given to you by your guildies, I don't think you should complain about having to roll for your shard.

i agree with you
but you could always disenchant them after the group disbands

i HATE it when i get a shard and everybodys like " ok cool lets roll" im like "wait wait wait this is mine. i can use it" im like WTF im thinking if u want it lvl your enchanting and get one yourself!

you definitely opened my eyes to this issue and now I agree with you. If there are other Enchanters in your group then they should roll but not the other ppl

See this what you should do, when they all ask if there is a DE'er just say no and you will still roll to see who will get the item for vendoring. Make sure you don't DE it when they are in the group or around you ^.^

ok im so sick of DEs... if you get some crap off the stupid mobs, be my geuss and keep it... as a Tankadin, that also enchants... i look at it like this i can clear trash by my self so i keep all that... but most bosses that i would be in a group for i dont mind rolling for the shards... i mean off the stuff i would be DEing you wouldn't get much really selling to vendors... i would say if you kept EVERY BOE item in 1 run sold them all to the vendor you would make maybe 10-15g... you will probly average 1-2 shards every run(atleast i do) which will sell for well more... then that.. so you should average a profit.... so once again minning and skinners dont share what they get since most of them could get it on their own.... if you get the shard by your self be my guest and keep it

one last comment on this is, if you want all the shards to yourself, just say if no one needs it we all roll greed... and if you win you get to DE it... it is called GREED for a reason

I aggree, I am abit biast because I am a chanter myself, but chanting is one of the hardest proffessions to level and at the same time, hardest to farm. Every other proffession can easily farm their mats any day and make hundreds of gold an hour. but all chanters have is the luck of finding greens while farming mods, or instances. So yes enchanters are making worthless loot more worthful, but that is the only way they can make gold out of that proffession besides advertising in trade. So, I think chanters should get first pick of the mats and maybe roll on ones that arn't needed by the chanter, like Dream Shards when the chanted has all the chants. But if they need the money, or need the mats to lvl their chanting, they should have the right to keep those mats they make.

Aswell, this I see alot is when there is 2 enchanters in the group, they will be rolling greed each to get the worthless item to DE, but without an overall decision to have chanters keep mats or roll on them, they one usually keeps the ones they get and the other is forced by grp to give them out, and the one that is forced is usually forced by the other chanter.

In the end, it is a group decision of what to do. But really, I think chanters should keep their mats they make like skinners do, miners do, and herbers do.

Yea, I'm an herbalist and i usually just roll against the other herbers, but whenever i get a shard, i never do anything with it, im not a big AH person, but it ends up collecting dust in my bank, i still have 10 void crystals from bc and an abyss crystal doing nothing in my bank, its nice to get a few hundred gold every once and a while for your shards, but still, if you give it to the enchanter, you might get an enchant back in return

This may make me sound like a bad person, but if no-one brings up the fact I had been given blues to DE at the end of my PUGs (which they almost never do) I keep the shards for myself. Call me a ninja but hey it's one of the few ways I can actually make some gold.